Need Expert Horseman Answer to 2 Questions

[Unknown]

Have been arguing with friend about 2 things.                                                                                                                             1. Does "matinee" racing ALWAYS mean horses race for no money?                                                                                                                            2. Do some horses at Delaware matinee (usually 2-year-olds) sometimes race with driver in jog cart?                                                                                                                                Thanks in advance.                                                                   

[AmyHollar]

I'm no expert......but I do play one on tv.

Matinee means afternoon racing.

Yes they will race in jog carts but not for a charted line......they are "time-bar" races.

[Unknown]

Thank you. Asked for expert horseMAN's answer, but will accept yours with grain of salt. Just kidding. So matinee's can run for money? I always knew that. Idiot friend said it means racing for no money. Did Jenny ever drive a horse in jog cart in race during Delaware matinee?

[Just Saying]

In IL when we had many "Matinees" they were all non-purse, but we would award tokens (blankets, halters, whips, etc) and race sponsors would cover the cost. Some cards offer non-charted races which don't show up on the horse's records. Our group had to drop our Matinee years back when the overhead got too high. By the time we payed for the Starting Gate, Charter, Event Insurance, USTA License, Sound system, water, fuel, advertising, etc. we couldn't cover costs. Too bad... it was good for all involved. Great folks donated their time & equipment and sponsorships. The Babies all got to see a starting gate, and actually race against other horses.

[Headpole Dave]

Matinee does not always mean afternoon racing.

Read this page, its a nice history of matinee racing and how it was formed, and how it has evolved:

http://matineeclub.tripod.com/BBytes/RiseandFall.html

[Unknown]

Wow. Thanks. That was above and beyond what I was expecting. My buddy was right, in a sense, in that matinee racing means "no money racing" in harness old-school. I'll have to call the bet even & say we're both right in different ways.

[LVGaryD]

Certainly no longer a horseman, but if I get much dumber I could be one again. Most matinees I was involved in had to do with a large female groom either on a hay pile near the jog carts or in a tack room.

Many involved marijuana and/or alcohol....mainly because that is what it took to get the job done. 

[Wilderness]

Matinee does not always mean afternoon racing.

Read this page, its a nice history of matinee racing and how it was formed, and how it has evolved:

http://matineeclub.tripod.com/BBytes/RiseandFall.html

Dave,
          FWIW, Susan Zimmerman wrote those articles and created those web pages.
 They been online ten years or more.
 Susan continues to do some very interesting research on the old Ohio fairs and harness racing.

[Headpole Dave]

I have to say that she did a very good job on that particular article. Very well researched and full of great detail and information! Well written and concise! I'd love to read any others she may have if you can point me in the proper direction.

[Wilderness]

Have been arguing with friend about 2 things.                                                                                                                             1. Does "matinee" racing ALWAYS mean horses race for no money?                                                                                                                            2. Do some horses at Delaware matinee (usually 2-year-olds) sometimes race with driver in jog cart?                                                                                                                                Thanks in advance.                                                                   

 Most racing these days is rarely contested without some type of purses.
 Seem to recall that Gaitway holds some races (besides qualifiers) that are baby races without purses.

A while back I archived a race-photo from one of the Orlando tracks (40's) where the winner used a race-bike and the others were using jog-carts

 In the very, very olden days they use to race for almost anything. Bales of hay, bags of feed.
 Some of large-donated prize lists for the NJ Road Horse Association (Weequahic Park) in the 1920s were simply amazing. Same for the Boston Tracks that were part of the Gentleman's Driving Club of that area.

 Many of the nearly-pure Sterling Silver (frequently complete place settings) were worth more than the purse of the old races. Most of this Sterling Silver stuff has long vanished (likely melted and sold), however they are simply amazing in the old photo's.

 In early 2002 a trophy was the 1890s was sold at auction. From Michigan's old Grosse Pointe Track. Sold for $37,500.
 I saved the two dozen high-quality photo's the auction house offered online and the detail is unparalleled.

[Wilderness]

I have to say that she did a very good job on that particular article. Very well researched and full of great detail and information! Well written and concise! I'd love to read any others she may have if you can point me in the proper direction.

Dave,
          Just scroll down to the bottom of that page and there are links to half-a-dozen more of her articles.

[Unknown]

Certainly no longer a horseman, but if I get much dumber I could be one again. Most matinees I was involved in had to do with a large female groom either on a hay pile near the jog carts or in a tack room.

Many involved marijuana and/or alcohol....mainly because that is what it took to get the job done. 

Amy?

[LVGaryD]

Amy?

I don't think so, but maybe her mom??? Things are sort of foggy from those days. 

[Wilderness]

Dave,
           Here's the main page of the site:
http://matineeclub.tripod.com/

[LVGaryD]

I don't think so, but maybe her mom??? Things are sort of foggy from those days. 

By the way, this is not meant to imply in any way, shape, or form that Mutter is a large woman!