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General Category => General Harness Racing Discussion => Topic started by: RocknRoll on March 05, 2013, 10:04:11 AM
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ORC suspends Casie Coleman indefinitely
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March 05, 2013 | Print View
Casie Coleman, recently honored as Canada's 2012 Trainer of the Year, the record fifth time she has been recognized with the O'Brien Award, has been suspended indefinitely by the Ontario Racing Commission (ORC). The ORC ruling came as it is investigating the matter with a hearing date yet to be scheduled.
The suspension was issued on Monday and it scheduled to begin on Tuesday. Coleman, who is winter training at South Florida Trotting Center, is currently racing her horses at Woodbine and Yonkers Raceway (she has only three starts this year at the Meadowlands). Coleman has a 36-6-6-3 slate this year at Woodbine and she is currently fifth in the dash standings at Yonkers with a record of 34-12-8-2 (a UTR of .503).
The Harness Edge reported Tuesday morning that Coleman received positive tests for the Class IV drug Flumethasone—a corticosteroid for topical use—on horses Mick Dynamite, Hilarious Halo and Run On Luck.
Coleman, who stable earned a record $6.85 million last year, is the trainer of Michael's Power, voted the 2012 Horse of the Year in Canada. She also is the conditioner of Betterthancheddar, who won the 2012 O'Brien as Older Pacer of the Year.
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I told people years ago when she first went to Ontario that she was cheating and I'm not surprised to see this happen. The form reversals on horses like Red Pop, Prime Time Bobcat and dozens of others weren't natural. If you've ever met the woman she has about a 5 word vocabulary of "awesome" "super" "just awesome" and "f**k off Blake." I don't think she can spell horse. Not a fan and never have been.
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Flumethasone? She got suspended indefinitely for rubbing stuff on their legs? You have got to be kidding me.
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Pharmacology:
Indication For the treatment of contact dermatitis, atopic dermatitis, exczema, psoriasis, diaper rash and other skin conditions
Now there is some potent stuff that will help a horse go five seconds faster! Dumbasses got her for treating diaper rash.
rflmao1 rflmao1 rflmao1 rflmao1
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Not a horseman and before Gary posted that I didnt know what the drug is.
Alot of the gamblers dont understand the suspensions ( not meaning you HPD) or why they happen.
That the drugs are given 100% for theraputic reasons. But there are just rules about it. Alot of it is not malicious. It is in the horses interest.
I am also worried about the witch hunt attitude that alot seem to have.
I dont know how healthy it is.
That said I have no doubt that alot of the big time name trainers are up to no good and dont really care alot about the horses.
It really keeps my interest in the big time racing down.
I do believe the Pena thing about him having something that just masks everything so you could basicly do anything you wanted to the animal and it wouldnt show up.
If he had that. Its foolish to thnk he is the only trainer to ever have it.
Ive heard enough from people I trust and regard to think Carmine Fusco and Pena are no good.
Casie Coleman I dont know about.
Toscano Ive heard only good things about.
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I knew her when she was a groom for Bill Davis and Travis Umphrey. I knew her old man when he couldn't bat .200 at Fraser Downs. I knew her when she tried to put out a fire with a bottle of alcohol. She's incredibly dumb, and you only have to look at her literacy skills to see it... Why was every horse she ever had hung up the same way? How do you explain the 9 year olds dropping 3 seconds off life marks after a week on the program? Her name was on the infamous list that circulated through on the EPO scandal that got a man on these harness forums shot and killed. Other names on there like Robinson, Elliot, and many more. How is Phil (her father) suddenly a .300 plus trainer after being much lower on a C track? It doesn't add up. Well actually it does - it adds up to them being cheaters.
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I wont mention names.
But I know of people who are literaly illiterate ( one at least who cant read or write) who are great horseman.
The education level for a 3rd generation horseman may not be high.
Horsemanship can be though.
Not indicting them all. Some like CC even have college degrees.
Just saying some who you would think have 65 IQs are damn good horseman and drivers.
But I get your point dave.
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Thats actually a steroid drug and I believe it was one the Mr Pena was accused of using also idunno
That's kind of funny the two hottest trainers on the planet used the same stuff, I guess he gave his
with enough time away not to show a hot test. idunno
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Skipper, cortisone is a steroid drug and every single horse trainer on Earth has used dmso and cortisone on horses. I hear it is not legal like it was when I trained, but we used it even in the paddock. Hell I still use it on myself sometimes.
Just more government intervention. 4pezz2
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And rules are rules hitdatsumbitch
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Skipper, cortisone is a steroid drug and every single horse trainer on Earth has used dmso and cortisone on horses. I hear it is not legal like it was when I trained, but we used it even in the paddock. Hell I still use it on myself sometimes.
Just more government intervention. 4pezz2
I'm not disagreeing but if its not allowed its not allowed period.
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Marijuana is not totally legal either but it is the best thing any doctor could give a patient. And legal or not, when I hurt badly enough, I am going to get some into my system. Of course I am not suggesting horse trainers would use the stuff on either their horses or themselves... 8)
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Marijuana is not totally legal either but it is the best thing any doctor could give a patient. And legal or not, when I hurt badly enough, I am going to get some into my system. Of course I am not suggesting horse trainers would use the stuff on either their horses or themselves... 8)
Oh well I didn't realize that, my bad ! Let me call her lawyers and tell them because you're a pot head
she should be able to break the rules. slaphead noway
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Oh well I didn't realize that, my bad ! Let me call her lawyers and tell them because you're a pot head
she should be able to break the rules. slaphead noway
I would hardly describe myself as a pothead. I have not touched the stuff in 35 years, except under the advice of my doctors. And in total I would guess I have smoked it no more than 12 times in my entire life.
The rules need to be more realistic.
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The rules need to be more realistic.
It is just another black eye for the sport. Especially for outsiders looking in who don't understand it. Guilty until proven innocent.
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The rules need to be more realistic.
This may be the smartest thing you have EVER said. bowdown bowdown bowdown
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It is just another black eye for the sport. Especially for outsiders looking in who don't understand it. Guilty until proven innocent.
thumbsup thumbsup And it is where we have DROPPED the ball...........every positive is not a NARCOTIC PERFORMANCE ENHANCER.
To think Coleman is a genius and can drop horses three seconds for using flucord is as ridiculous as saying I can hoist full wheelbarrows over my head after I take four Ibuprofen.
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For the record.....Casie unfriended me long ago on Facebook..........and I was grateful..........her grammar had my butt puckering..........which leads me to wonder how in the hell anyone could think she is smart enough to outsmart every racing jurisdiction in North America...............or how about she's been damn lucky..............right place at the right time to build up a high quality stable.......to use top notch vets, caretakers, blacksmiths and feeding regimes..............I envy it.............you are never going to convince me there is a "magic drug"...........and if it is ever found.......I'm using it on my heel spur first.
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We need Lockjaw to put up a pick of a horse smoking a reefer with old LVGD driving. Hell, at least the bettors would know what is going on!
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For the record.....Casie unfriended me long ago on Facebook..........and I was grateful..........her grammar had my butt puckering..........which leads me to wonder how in the hell anyone could think she is smart enough to outsmart every racing jurisdiction in North America...............or how about she's been damn lucky..............right place at the right time to build up a high quality stable.......to use top notch vets, caretakers, blacksmiths and feeding regimes..............I envy it.............you are never going to convince me there is a "magic drug"...........and if it is ever found.......I'm using it on my heel spur first.
Just so you know.
She unfriended me too.
Why?
Her house got broken into while she was on vacation.
Posting about how great it was.
She was one of the first FB people to post about vacations and get robbed.
When is your vacation?
I could use some long johns and kersene oil for my lamp.
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Kerosene? Too fancy for us..........we just bed down over manure and hope it doesn't cool off till morning.
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OK I am a dumb f#ck that knows nothing, so please help me ! How do hundreds or maybe thousands of
races go every week but only a couple people get cracked for this shit ? And I'm thinking this stuff is used
for other things other then diaper rash, but remember I am a dumb f#ck !
Flucort Solution Caution
Federal law restricts this drug to use by or on the order of a licensed veterinarian.
General
FLUCORT (flumethasone) is a chemical modification of prednisolone which possesses greater anti-inflammatory and gluconeogenic properties than the parent compound when compared on an equivalent basis. Due to the potency of FLUCORT Solution, dosage recommendations should be consulted prior to drug administration. Chemically, it is 6α, 9α-difluoro-16α methylprednisolone. The structural formula is as follows:
Description
The active ingredient of FLUCORT Solution is flumethasone which occurs as a white to creamy white, odorless, crystalline powder. The appearance of FLUCORT Solution is a clear colorless to slightly yellowish mobile liquid.
Each mL of the injectable preparation contains 0.5 mg flumethasone, 420 mg polyethylene glycol 400, 9 mg benzyl alcohol as a preservative, 8 mg sodium chloride, 0.1 mg citric acid, sodium hydroxide and/or hydrochloric acid for pH adjustment when necessary, and water for injection USP, q.s.
Clinical Pharmacology
Flumethasone has been reported (1) to possess 700 times the glucocorticoid activity of cortisol (hydrocortisone) as measured in the liver glycogen deposition assay in the rat; 120 times that of cortisol in the cotton pellet assay in the rat; and also in the same animal, shows a net excretion of sodium.
In similar tests in rats, another report (2) showed flumethasone 730 times more potent than cortisol in the granuloma inhibition assay and 165 times the activity of cortisol in the glycogen deposition assay. The same report showed that in man, the compound possessed 7.8 times the potency of prednisolone.
An additional report (3) indicated that flumethasone possessed 677 times the potency of cortisol in the liver glycogen deposition test in the rat, and 30, 25, and 31 times respectively, the eosinopenic, hyperglycemic and antirheumatic potency of cortisol, as measured in man.
Veterinary experimental studies utilizing the eosinophil depression test in normal dogs and blood glucose elevation and eosinophil depression in normal cattle as parameters of drug activity, in comparison tests involving prednisone and dexamethasone, indicate that flumethasone possesses greater anti-inflammatory and gluconeogenic activity than these compounds, on an equivalent basis.
Clinical evidence of drug potency obtained during evaluation of the compound and based upon effective drug dosage levels further substantiates the above experimental findings.
General Effects of Adrenocorticoids
The adrenocorticoids are divided into two main classes: mineralocorticoids and glucocorticoids, based on their major physiologic and pharmacologic actions.
Mineralocorticoids such as the naturally occurring desoxycorticosterone and aldosterone are mainly concerned with hydration, sodium and potassium regulation and the normal renal glomerular filtration of these two electrolytes. The mineralocorticoids have little if any effect as anti-inflammatory agents, and are not widely used in medicine.
Glucocorticoids include the naturally occurring compounds, cortisone and hydrocortisone. Their major effects are as follows:
1. Increase protein catabolism and gluconeogenesis.
2. Depression of lymphoid tissue, fibroblasts and eosinophils.
3. Increase the sense of well being and tolerance to pain.
4. Depress thyroid function and anterior pituitary function through reciprocal influences.
5. Influence vasoconstrictive response of the circulatory system to norepinephrine, helping to maintain blood pressure.
6. Increase renal flow.
7. Influence gastric HCl and pepsin production.
8. Reduces the secretion of mucus from respiratory and enteric mucosa.
9. Affect to some degree sodium retention and potassium excretion.
10. Stimulate erythropoiesis and myelopoiesis.
Synthetic analogues of cortisone and hydrocortisone containing a double bond between carbon 1 and 2 of the corticosteroid nucleus, resulted in compounds with a greatly decreased effect on electrolyte metabolism. Additional molecular changes present in other synthetic corticoids presently used in medicine such as methylation at carbons 6 or 16 and hydroxylation at carbon 16, have led to a further decrease in electrolyte imbalance noted with the naturally occurring glucocorticoids. Fluorination at carbon 6 and/or 9 have led to a marked increase in anti-inflammatory activity.
The synthetic glucocorticoids exhibit a marked increase in potency in that a smaller amount of drug is required to elicit the same effects seen only with larger amounts of the natural glucocorticoids. It is also noted that the synthetic analogues persist for a longer period of time in the body which is believed due to their slower metabolism and excretion.
Flucort Solution Indications
FLUCORT (flumethasone) Solution is recommended for the various rheumatic, allergic, dermatologic and other disease states which are known to be responsive to the anti-inflammatory corticoids.
Equine Indications
1. Musculoskeletal conditions due to inflammation, where permanent structural changes do not exist, such as bursitis, carpitis, osselets and myositis. Following therapy an appropriate period of rest should be instituted to allow a more normal return to function of the affected part.
2. In allergic states such as hives, urticaria and insect bites.
Canine Indications
1. Musculoskeletal conditions due to inflammation of muscles or joints and accessory structures, where permanent structural changes do not exist, such as arthritis, osteoarthritis, the disc syndrome and myositis. In septic arthritis appropriate antibacterial therapy should be concurrently administered.
2. In certain acute and chronic dermatoses of varying etiology to help control the pruritus, irritation and inflammation associated with these conditions. The drug has proven useful in otitis externa in conjunction with topical medication for similar reasons.
3. In allergic states such as hives, urticaria and insect bites.
4. Shock and shock-like states, (4) by intravenous administration.
Feline Indications
1. In certain acute and chronic dermatoses of varying etiology to help control the pruritus, irritation and inflammation associated with these conditions.
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Wow ... Increase the sense of well being and tolerance to pain...wonder if that would help any horses run
faster ? Reduces the secretion of mucus from respiratory and enteric mucosa....That probably wouldn't
help much either right ? Please help the dumb f#ck here cause i don't understand this is so confusing
to an idiot like myself.
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This is 2 suspensions in a year for her in Canada! She got 45 days for a positive on Reibercrombie last March
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Wow ... Increase the sense of well being and tolerance to pain...wonder if that would help any horses run
faster ? Reduces the secretion of mucus from respiratory and enteric mucosa....That probably wouldn't
help much either right ? Please help the dumb f#ck here cause i don't understand this is so confusing
to an idiot like myself.
Sounds like I need to be taking this stuff
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Flumethasone? She got suspended indefinitely for rubbing stuff on their legs? You have got to be kidding me.
The three horses who got the post race positive were at Woodbine while she was in Florida vacationing.
By the way none of the three horses won their respective races not that it matters.
Her hearing is scheduled for Mar 11
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I'm taking 5 years off to go back to school and become a pharmacist. Then I can return and take up my capping chores again. 4pezz2 4pezz2 4pezz2
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I'm taking 5 years off to go back to school and become a pharmacist. Then I can return and take up my capping chores again. 4pezz2 4pezz2 4pezz2
Hal, you already know it's often not the best trainer, it's the best chemist ! At the big purse tracks MOSTLY.
To make it simple lets just say my buddy Ralph takes 1 ambien a night to sleep with and that is with a
perscription and therapeutic to him and legal, now my buddy Herman stays up for 2 days and then takes
5 ambien and gets him screwier then Dennis Rodman on a 6 day bender. Anyway that's the way a dumb
f#ck like me looks at it. idunno
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Sounds like I need to be taking this stuff
You and me both buddy, I could really use it on weds night bowling, if I did I might break my streak
of bowling under 450 once. shootme Oh I forgot I don't have diaper rash (yet) hammerhead1
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Skipper: Before reading the pharmocology report I never knew there were that many big words. I'd have worn out 3 dictionaries looking them up. That's why I studied mechanical engineering. I learned complicated stuff like 80,000 lbs of down-pressure on a certain weld will make the f#cking thing break.
Don't even get me started on rocket surgery.
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a pharmacist can create a compound(flumethasone) and slightly change the ratio of ingredients and still mimic the drug in pre/post race testing. The point being in certain strengths , it can be used as a masking agent. The suspension tells me that the strength tested was beyond the the boundaries of being a late application. WEG doesn't know what's been masked but the lab has to work in breaking down the sample which takes time to find the masked ingredients.
ps. my wife is a pharmacist
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New groom set her up? Gotta get Anthony to crack the case :o)
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ps. my wife is a pharmacist
Please list the names of all your horses so I don't miss betting on them.
Please place an RX after the names of those you really think have a big shot. Thanks.
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COLEMAN,CASIE
ORC - POSITIVE TEST - CONDITIONS PER ORC POLICY DIRECTIVE 3-2008
CONDITIONS UPON RE-INSTATEMENT EXTENTION OF PROBATION
FROM MAY 5 2014 TO MAY 4 2016
Date Issued : 11-MAR-2013
Violation Occurred : at WOODBINE RACETRACK
COLEMAN,CASIE
ORC - BREACH OF PROBATIONS
Date Issued : 11-MAR-2013
Total Due : 10000.00
Violation Occurred : at WOODBINE RACETRACK
COLEMAN,CASIE
ORC - POSITIVE TEST - CLASS IV
Commission Rule Number : 9.09(B),26.02.01,26.02.02,26.02.03(C)
Date Issued : 11-MAR-2013
Total Due : 2000.00
Violation Occurred : Race 10 at WOODBINE RACETRACK on 16-FEB-2013 horse HILARIOUS HALO
Suspended From 04-APR-2013 To 18-APR-2013 (Full Suspension)
COLEMAN,CASIE
ORC - POSITIVE TEST - CLASS IV
Commission Rule Number : 9.09(B),26.02.01,26.02.02,26.02.03(C)
Date Issued : 11-MAR-2013
Total Due : 2000.00
Violation Occurred : Race 9 at WOODBINE RACETRACK on 22-FEB-2013 horse RUN ON LUCK
Suspended From 19-APR-2013 To 03-MAY-2013 (Full Suspension)
COLEMAN,CASIE
ORC - POSITIVE TEST - CLASS IV
7 DAYS TIME SERVED CREDITED
Commission Rule Number : 9.09(B),26.02.01,26.02.02,26.02.03(C)
Date Issued : 11-MAR-2013
Total Due : 2000.00
Violation Occurred : Race 5 at WOODBINE RACETRACK on 16-FEB-2013 horse MC DYNAMITE
Suspended From 05-MAR-2013 To 03-APR-2013 (Full Suspension)
Looks like a 16K fine, 60 days, the horses are suspended for a month, and her probation is now extended to 2016
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60 days for diaper rash medicine. Of course she was 2500 miles away when it happened. Casie needs old Gary D. to come out of retirement....but that ain't gonna happen unless I get the Florida contingent. 8)
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60 days for diaper rash medicine. Of course she was 2500 miles away when it happened. Casie needs old Gary D. to come out of retirement....but that ain't gonna happen unless I get the Florida contingent. 8)
You would make a charming couple!!
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You would make a charming couple!!
This would be a bidness only, professional relationship. Last time I looked, Casie was not Asian. slaphead rflmao1
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ps. my wife is a pharmacist
Please list the names of all your horses so I don't miss betting on them.
Please place an RX after the names of those you really think have a big shot. Thanks.
that would be cheating..maybe the guy with 200+ horses could help you..good luck
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I told people years ago when she first went to Ontario that she was cheating and I'm not surprised to see this happen. The form reversals on horses like Red Pop, Prime Time Bobcat and dozens of others weren't natural. If you've ever met the woman she has about a 5 word vocabulary of "awesome" "super" "just awesome" and "f**k off Blake." I don't think she can spell horse. Not a fan and never have been.
First off Dick head I hope someone shoves a headpole up your jealous ass.
RED POP.....CC form reversal..."OK"?...Rock N Roll Heavens Trainer Bruce Saunders had better success with RED POP...(Even though Rock N Roll Heaven saw Sportswriters ass a lot)...........Its funny mentioning Prime Time Bob Cat he was a claimer for what? 3 starts for CC...........But Anthony Montini did very good with Primetime Bobcat (I'm pretty sure Montini set a worlds record with Bobcat)....and raced in Invites not claimers with the horse...Im pretty sure he was in the big $ race at Hoosier...and had no Yellow or Blue on him.
" I don't think she can spell horse.": She can spell Million Dollar Race WINS, Little Brown Jug and Jugette Winner, Breeders Crown Wins, Jealous Lazy Goof. Hollywood Henderson should shove a headpole up your ass.
"she has about a 5 word vocabulary": She Forgot More Than You Will Ever Know GOOF.
Shes a horrible trainer....American Ideal...horrible horse and doing horrible in the breeding shed, Moving Pictures a rat, Sportswriter...Horrible Horse, Betterthancheddar...horrible............
I hope you go to the next car race at Daytona and sit in the front row Loser.
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First off Dick head I hope someone shoves a headpole up your jealous ass.
RED POP.....CC form reversal..."OK"?...Rock N Roll Heavens Trainer Bruce Saunders had better success with RED POP...(Even though Rock N Roll Heaven saw Sportswriters ass a lot)...........Its funny mentioning Prime Time Bob Cat he was a claimer for what? 3 starts for CC...........But Anthony Montini did very good with Primetime Bobcat (I'm pretty sure Montini set a worlds record with Bobcat)....and raced in Invites not claimers with the horse...Im pretty sure he was in the big $ race at Hoosier...and had no Yellow or Blue on him.
" I don't think she can spell horse.": She can spell Million Dollar Race WINS, Little Brown Jug and Jugette Winner, Breeders Crown Wins, Jealous Lazy Goof. Hollywood Henderson should shove a headpole up your ass.
"she has about a 5 word vocabulary": She Forgot More Than You Will Ever Know GOOF.
Shes a horrible trainer....American Ideal...horrible horse and doing horrible in the breeding shed, Moving Pictures a rat, Sportswriter...Horrible Horse, Betterthancheddar...horrible............
I hope you go to the next car race at Daytona and sit in the front row Loser.
Very solid points. heartluv
That headpole up the ass...is there a large rolling metal burr on it?
rflmao1 rflmao1 rflmao1
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Hungary, don't "sugar coat" stuff. Tell us what you really think. rflmao1
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First off Dick head I hope someone shoves a headpole up your jealous ass.
RED POP.....CC form reversal..."OK"?...Rock N Roll Heavens Trainer Bruce Saunders had better success with RED POP...(Even though Rock N Roll Heaven saw Sportswriters ass a lot)...........Its funny mentioning Prime Time Bob Cat he was a claimer for what? 3 starts for CC...........But Anthony Montini did very good with Primetime Bobcat (I'm pretty sure Montini set a worlds record with Bobcat)....and raced in Invites not claimers with the horse...Im pretty sure he was in the big $ race at Hoosier...and had no Yellow or Blue on him.
" I don't think she can spell horse.": She can spell Million Dollar Race WINS, Little Brown Jug and Jugette Winner, Breeders Crown Wins, Jealous Lazy Goof. Hollywood Henderson should shove a headpole up your ass.
"she has about a 5 word vocabulary": She Forgot More Than You Will Ever Know GOOF.
Shes a horrible trainer....American Ideal...horrible horse and doing horrible in the breeding shed, Moving Pictures a rat, Sportswriter...Horrible Horse, Betterthancheddar...horrible............
I hope you go to the next car race at Daytona and sit in the front row Loser.
Classy post.
Mark MacDonald is a buddy of mine, and I've known Coleman a long time. Back when her family was stealing feed on the Fraser Downs backstretch because they couldn't afford to pay for it...You're not impressing me with anything you just wrote. Because I know where she came from, I know who she is... She made it to the top putting huge form reversals on all of her horses. There was no secret back when she came to the WEG circuit that her horses were the Pena horses of her time... she'd claim one and it would drop seconds of it's form. Within a week. Everyone of her horses hung up the same way.
After she made her way to the top, she got some good owners and started getting power in her stable. No doubt about it and she mostly got out of the claiming part... But you can't rewrite history, and everyone in the industry knew she was using something. Just like Pena, Just like Robinson, Pelling, etc.... Eventually they all get caught.
And she did... again. This is her second major positive test within 12 months. She has "no idea" how this happened though... Noticed her horses just keep racing under Andrew Harris as well. You think that's fair to other people in the sport?
How come you never mentioned Phil's meteoric soaring to the top? Phil who couldn't train about .200 lifetime, suddenly couldn't be beat in Ontario either. Explain that one please.
As far as going to Daytona? I'm not big into car racing, but unlike you, I could pack up and go anytime I chose. I don't need to wish death or physical harm on you, you're not worth it... Being alive in your miserable world is enough of a sentence for you. Take care.
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If Casie is so "stupid" how did she acquire the big drugs making her so successful and avoid detection?
I totally disagree about this being a major positive................it's a major PENALTY for a Class IV medication which in my opinion needs to be further explained to the public so this nonsense would stop.
On the flip side........I know she can't spell........I was her Facebook friend until she un-friended me.
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If Casie is so "stupid" how did she acquire the big drugs making her so successful and avoid detection?
I totally disagree about this being a major positive................it's a major PENALTY for a Class IV medication which in my opinion needs to be further explained to the public so this nonsense would stop.
On the flip side........I know she can't spell........I was her Facebook friend until she un-friended me.
might as well save ur breath. u could get a positive for something in baby shampoo and someone would go all commando. and that's about close to what her positives r . the micro amounts they can pick up are ridiculous to call positives. guidelines need to be redrawn with some common sense. but that ain't gonna happen soon cause most places stilll have racing commissions that r looking for the "big kill" and the only thing the big kill will do is further the decline of horse racing. i haven't seen Casie even come close to Pena yet. Now there's someone you'd like to know what he was "really" doing. rflmao1
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You guys can defend her all you want but when the drug facts were posted by the skipper they seemed like performance enhancers. She also got her probation extended because she was busted for something just last year.
It's always the same whining by Amy as well.. someone gets suspended for a performance enhancer but it is the penalty they get that gives the sport a black eye, not the trainer that used the banned substance.
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You guys can defend her all you want but when the drug facts were posted by the skipper they seemed like performance enhancers. She also got her probation extended because she was busted for something just last year.
It's always the same whining by Amy as well.. someone gets suspended for a performance enhancer but it is the penalty they get that gives the sport a black eye, not the trainer that used the banned substance.
Whether it is a performance enhancer or not ( I don't know) your post is right on the money. Yes she is in Florida, still her responsibility and this is twice in a year that something happened. bowdown
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It's always the same whining by Amy as well.. someone gets suspended for a performance enhancer but it is the penalty they get that gives the sport a black eye, not the trainer that used the banned substance.
Wrong. Not for class 1 and 2.
Lasix can be considered performance enhancing. The molecular structure of our feed supplements is considered performance enhancing. Purina mixes our grain with Lysene. Performance enhancing? What about the medicines in our leg paints and lineaments? Performance enhancing? You can get a positive test for treating a sick horse with penicillin!
I'll whine until common sense is used and not witch hunts.
Far less guidelines and regulations exist in all major sports involving humans than are allowed in horse racing!
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And I spelt wrung on porpose!
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Whether it is a performance enhancer or not ( I don't know) your post is right on the money. Yes she is in Florida, still her responsibility and this is twice in a year that something happened. bowdown
I've never questioned her ultimate responsibility. The risk she takes.
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This is getting ridiculous ! I have nothing against CC and really have no feelings one way or another.
I don't get how horse people who to me are honest can defend these violations, that to me is very
disturbing. If used PROPERLY and the way things are meant to be used I have no problem, but these
drugs are being misused and that is where the problem is. ALL horsemen know what to give when to
give and how much to give a horse for therapeutic reasons, how come only certain people get caught
"making a mistake" over and over and over and for the same thing ? I am or was the biggest Joe
Anderson fan that he ever had but you know what ? Joe could not follow the rules and ran himself
out of the business and all I can say is "F#ck him" ! I really don't understand Anyone's logic here,
and if you really think this stuff was used because the horse had diaper rash or a fly bite in the
winter in Canada then I want to invite you guys into my investment group noway Yes class 3,4,5
drugs used improperly are against the rules for those of you that don't know that slaphead hammerhead1
I'm done with this thread and to be frank very disappointed with some of the logic and replies that
are in here. I'm going to go get my cop buddies from the bowling alley some lemon poppy seed muffins
now and hope they get piss tested in the next day or two, that would be hilarious. shootme
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Skipper I wish you wouldn't give up on the discussion. I am in no way familiar with what happened in Casie's case. Maybe she was trying to gain the advantage.......but as you pointed out.......all horsemen know how to use and when to use certain medications, if this is true why would someone with her success think she was going to get away with it?
I do not refute the breaking of the rules...........I do refute punishment fitting the crime............Casie can afford the days and monetary punishment........could most horsemen?
No
Most horsemen are not trying to make a horse exceed it's natural ability. Most medications are designed and used to help a horse reach his natural ability.
Which is why most of us are so diligent on everything which our horses come in contact with........but with human interaction comes human mistakes. It's in the back of our minds constantly.
For example......there is a medication for treating horses with problem feet. You need to "stay out" 48 hours in Ohio.......every time I see Buck grinding up pills to dose a horse I'm paranoid about clean up and the possibility of cross contamination.
But is it fair to not treat the horse? Or should a medication used to treat basic foot problems not be given?
They are athletes...........they are treated more medically sound than many of us treat ourselves.
I have had and will always have HUGE issues with how our industry has educated the public.........the total blame lays on our shoulders...............and I'm afraid it is almost too late to right the ship.
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Amen Amy. I am not on a yahoo poor Cassie band wagon but I am also not going to hang her in the town square for these legal meds used too close to post time . She is in Florida. Some Cassie employees may no longer Cassie employees after this one. You have to walk a fine line treating horses with approved safe meds and God forbid the hungover groom or 2nd trainer or morning feeder did not clean out the feed tub before he fed and hello you have positive because the horse had a handful of feed left over and got ate the next day with the morning feed. If it says 24 hrs. on meds better make it 48 hrs. ya never know.
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Classy post.
Mark MacDonald is a buddy of mine, and I've known Coleman a long time. Back when her family was stealing feed on the Fraser Downs backstretch because they couldn't afford to pay for it...You're not impressing me with anything you just wrote. Because I know where she came from, I know who she is... She made it to the top putting huge form reversals on all of her horses. There was no secret back when she came to the WEG circuit that her horses were the Pena horses of her time... she'd claim one and it would drop seconds of it's form. Within a week. Everyone of her horses hung up the same way.
After she made her way to the top, she got some good owners and started getting power in her stable. No doubt about it and she mostly got out of the claiming part... But you can't rewrite history, and everyone in the industry knew she was using something. Just like Pena, Just like Robinson, Pelling, etc.... Eventually they all get caught.
And she did... again. This is her second major positive test within 12 months. She has "no idea" how this happened though... Noticed her horses just keep racing under Andrew Harris as well. You think that's fair to other people in the sport?
How come you never mentioned Phil's meteoric soaring to the top? Phil who couldn't train about .200 lifetime, suddenly couldn't be beat in Ontario either. Explain that one please.
As far as going to Daytona? I'm not big into car racing, but unlike you, I could pack up and go anytime I chose. I don't need to wish death or physical harm on you, you're not worth it... Being alive in your miserable world is enough of a sentence for you. Take care.
"Because I know where she came from, I know who she is..."
OK....Jealous Stalker...
A Canadian Born Trainer who has Won $ Million Dollar Races Jealous Goof. One of my favorite singers grew up poor in Ontario...her name....Shania Twain.
"She made it to the top putting huge form reversals on all of her horses."
Yep...I guess every Horse but Primetime Bobcat & Red Pop. Please tell us if Saunders and Montini cheated with those 2 horses since you (don't) know all.
"But you can't rewrite history, and everyone in the industry knew she was using something. Just like Pena, Just like Robinson, Pelling, etc.... Eventually they all get caught."
Ron and Mickey Burke post here all the time...are they in the group of people who everyone knows are using? As far as I know Pena never failed a drug test and Pelling never failed one.
"Noticed her horses just keep racing under Andrew Harris as well. You think that's fair to other people in the sport?"
I used to see horses being trained by Mickey Burke...then out of the blue I saw Ron Burke...was/is that fair to other people in the sport?
"How come you never mentioned Phil's meteoric soaring to the top? Phil who couldn't train about .200 lifetime, suddenly couldn't be beat in Ontario either. Explain that one please."
Sounds like Mickey Burke.
"And she did... again. This is her second major positive test within 12 months. She has "no idea" how this happened though..."
Guilty as charged....Here is the MAJOR Positive Tests:
Ephedrine is a Class III drug and now a Class IV...better call Columbo. It's not like a groom peeing Oxycodonein (Class I) in the stall.
"but unlike you, I could pack up and go anytime I chose."
Yep...I'm typing this from "The Big House"...wait I am not a Fan of Michigan College...but I root for Da "U"
"Being alive in your miserable world"
Have fun in your Jealous world...Guess who the youngest trainer in harness racing history to surpass the $40 million career earnings mark is? Hint think Royal Blue & Gold!
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Duck and dodge, say a lot of nothing.
I never brought up Burke, nor will I... Why are you trying to implicate him with Coleman's positives?
And Burke was never stupid enough to try and put out a fire with a bottle of alcohol. He's a little sharper then that...
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HPD. you used to work for Cassie or something? idunno Some people are able to hide their dirty laundry better than others. its all in who you know. i would think you would know that. slaphead
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HPD. you used to work for Cassie or something? idunno Some people are able to hide their dirty laundry better than others. its all in who you know. i would think you would know that. slaphead
Could say the same thing about Hungary and the burkes to be fair.
I thought he did good when he moved to the meadowlands and his horses fit in favorable classes the first couple months because they were in at their meadows level
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HPD. you used to work for Cassie or something? idunno Some people are able to hide their dirty laundry better than others. its all in who you know. i would think you would know that. slaphead
No, I've owned horses out here and I know the people that employed her as a groom, and I know her family.
I don't think very highly of any of them.
I'll not post anymore about it, but there's no doubt in my mind at all that she was and continues to use enhancers to win.
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Yep...I guess every Horse but Primetime Bobcat & Red Pop. Please tell us if Saunders and Montini cheated with those 2 horses since you (don't) know all.
Actually Saunders didn't do very well with Red Pop , claimed the horse for 65k off of Coleman and never made his money back.
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I dont really have an opinion on the matter but I do think the arguement that when somebody claims a horse or gets it into their barn and the horse drops, they are using something is utterly ridiculous. We have no clue what happened after the barn change. There are many things that can be done to drop a horse that do not involve doping. Maybe a vet found something that the previous trainers vet missed, maybe the training/jogging schedule/style was different and the horse responded to it, maybe it was as simple as a change of scenery. For example, Lucky Jim was in Smedshammers barn, I believe, before team Orange Crush got him and he could trot at all but then boom the horse got good and he was the best horse in training for awhile, it happens in this business.
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I used to see horses being trained by Mickey Burke...then out of the blue I saw Ron Burke...was/is that fair to other people in the sport?
"How come you never mentioned Phil's meteoric soaring to the top? Phil who couldn't train about .200 lifetime, suddenly couldn't be beat in Ontario either. Explain that one please."
Sounds like Mickey Burke.
Mickey's UDRS
2008 .351
2007 .371
2006 .339
2005 .362
2004 .307
2003 .323
2002 .304
2001 .322
2000 .342
1999 .305
1998 .360
1997 .331
1996 .333
1995 .368
I wouldn't call that out of the blue.
There's a better shot of Frank Sinatra posting on here than Mickey Burke .
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He's a little sharper then that...
http://www.harnesslink.com/www/Article.cgi?ID=103638
“It might sound like a "RETARDED" aspiration but I want to win 1,000 races this year and $20 million in purses and I’ve got the best owners and drivers to call on to achieve that.
Yep...he's real sharp...and very classy?
Donk:
Mickey Burke's Career Training Statistics as of March 1, 2007
Year Starts Wins 2nds 3rds Earnings UDRS
2007 309 82 53 37 $788,085 .401
2006 2171 450 337 297 $5,696,654 .339
2005 1424 301 267 196 $3,293,422 .361
2004 1257 222 195 168 $1,400,736 .307
2003 1234 230 203 168 $1,233,784 .323
2002 925 162 144 117 $1,006,822 .304
2001 896 166 146 122 $985,784 .321
2000 666 140 115 72 $666,240 .342
1999 609 109 84 90 $501,175 .305
1998 231 46 44 38 $194,836 .360
1996 1 0 0 1 $2,490 .333
1995 19 4 3 4 $6,501 .368
1994 27 2 7 9 $31,009 .329
1993 10 1 1 2 $8,661 .222
1992 7 0 0 1 $2,990 .048
1991 528 78 63 73 $192,273 .260
Total 1,993 $16,011,462
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I don't remember the title of this thread being Ronnie and/or Mickey Burke suspended indefinitely.
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Mickey Burke's Career Training Statistics as of March 1, 2007
Year Starts Wins 2nds 3rds Earnings UDRS
2007 309 82 53 37 $788,085 .401
2006 2171 450 337 297 $5,696,654 .339
2005 1424 301 267 196 $3,293,422 .361
2004 1257 222 195 168 $1,400,736 .307
2003 1234 230 203 168 $1,233,784 .323
2002 925 162 144 117 $1,006,822 .304
2001 896 166 146 122 $985,784 .321
2000 666 140 115 72 $666,240 .342
1999 609 109 84 90 $501,175 .305
1998 231 46 44 38 $194,836 .360
1996 1 0 0 1 $2,490 .333
1995 19 4 3 4 $6,501 .368
1994 27 2 7 9 $31,009 .329
1993 10 1 1 2 $8,661 .222
1992 7 0 0 1 $2,990 .048
1991 528 78 63 73 $192,273 .260
Total 1,993 $16,011,462
And ?
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It might be "topical" for human use, but, for horses, it's an injectable. In addition to being a potent anti-inflammatory, as a glucocorticoid, it also acts as a coactivator for STAT5-dependent transcription upon growth hormone (GH) stimulation. Larger, stronger, faster, right? Wonder if the Commission is smart enough to figure out the piece of the puzzle they've stumbled upon... or if this will continue to be minimized as a "topical."
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And ?
Obviously when you have a steady growth in starts and remain consistent something must be up.